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Interfaith Dialogue and the Ground Zero Mosque

August 21st, 2010

I am, of course, interested in peace and seek out insights from people who know more than I do about various conflicts. I ran across one such person on the Huffington Post and was so taken by her articles on the Middle East that I invited her onto the show.


Sara Reef is a Program Manager with Intersections International in New York City focusing on cross cultural communications, with a focus on the Middle East. She did her undergraduate work at American University with a double major in international relations and history, spent a year at the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, and has an MA from the City University of  New York.

Intersections International was created in 2007 as a ministry of the Collegiate Churches of New York. It was funded on the sale of church property, and its mission is to promote social justice and peace making. Intersections operates in three areas: interfaith dialogue, consequences of conflict, and empowering marginalized communities.

The Te’a Project is a theater project based on interviews with 60 Muslim Americans. From those interviews, dramatic vignettes were developed. Intersections produced a theater piece based on those vignettes, which has been shown in various venues around New York City. After the vignettes, the audience is engaged in a conversation about stereotyping. Sarah tells us the story of one man whose worldview was completely shifted by the evening. He realized, after watching the vignettes, that he had been stereotyping the people of Islam. Intersections hopes that this project can spread as a model throughout the United States. For example, the model can be used to open a dialogue on gay and lesbian rights in San Francisco, immigration in Phoenix, and so on.

ChangeTheStory.net, another Intersections project, is an online tool for bridging the gap of understanding between US and Muslim countries. The website has three modules, Meet Your Neighbor, Change Your Story, and Change the World. Each of these modules provides resources and materials to develop better cross-cultural understanding.

The International Peacemaker Program is a joint program between Intersections and the Hartford Seminary. Young leaders attended the seminary from all over the world and learn conflict resolution, dialogue, and facilitation processes that they can take back to their countries. As they mature into positions of senior leadership, they are expected to use these tools to promote peace and understanding a little of conflict and violence within their regions.

The Iraqi Voices project is a documentary film bringing awareness to the plight of Iraqi refugees in Jordan, Syria, and Lebanon. More than 2.2 million Iraqis have been displaced by the wars in Iraq, and the displacement problem is one of the largest humanitarian issues today. However, the press has not been given a problem in the attention and there are few resources available to assist these people. The documentary film tells their story and makes the case that this is a potential future security threat if not addressed immediately.

Sara and I talk about the controversy over the proposal to build an Islamic community center two blocks from Ground Zero. The project is known as Cordoba House at Park 51. The issue has generated national controversy because some people have begun to treat Ground Zero as sacred land. Some segments of our society are unhappy that an Islamic community center will be constructed near the site of the most destructive terrorist attack perpetrated on the United States by radical Islamic terrorists. Intersections has raised the issue on its website and is encouraging dialogue around the controversy. Sara and I both agree that this is Second Amendment constitutional issue involving the separation of the state from religious affairs. As long as the zoning laws permit construction and operation of the community center, it should be built regardless of its religious orientation.

The Kazakhstan project is an interfaith dialogue process developed between the government of Kazakhstan and intersections. Kazakhstan is a central Asian country with an Islamic majority and the secular government. Unlike many of its neighbors, it has been stable since its emancipation from the Soviet Union 18 years ago. Kazakhstan is currently the chair of the OSCE. In preparation for assuming the chair, Kazakhstan engaged Intersections to help it devise a series of interfaith dialogues in the United States, Europe, and Kazakhstan.

The Veterans-Civilian dialogue project brings Afghanistan and Iraqi veterans together with civilians for dialogues about veteran’s experiences in the Middle East. These dialogues are helping veterans to reintegrate into their communities by giving them a voice and allowing opportunities for community members to understand the unique experience of serving as a military member in the Middle East.

Intersections International has undertaken a plate full of projects in the short, three-year term of its existence. Although much of its work is directly felt in the New York City area, within a year or so all of us will be hearing more about its projects as they are rolled out across the United States. You can find out more about Intersections at its website www.intersectionsinternational.org.

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Making Peace with Farm Animals-Heifer International

August 11th, 2010

There are peacemakers and then there are peacemakers. One of the great peacemaking organizations in the world is Heifer International. In existence for over 65 years, Heifer International is unique in its approach to solving world problems. It has helped millions of families rise out of poverty by gifts of livestock, seeds and trees and extensive training, which provide a multiplying source of food and income. Heifer likes to say that it gives a hand up rather than a hand out.


I asked the Heifer people who would be best to teach us about the organization, and they introduced me to Ora Bytyci. Ora graduated from the University of Prishtina with a degree in Management and Information Technology. Because of the violence in Kosovo, she moved to London. Eight years ago, she returned to Prishtina and began working for Heifer International Kosovo as an administrative assistant. It wasn’t long before she became Director of Operations in Kosovo, the position she holds today. She also works with other Heifer organizations in central and eastern Europe, helping with strategic planning and fund raising.

Heifer International is a nonprofit humanitarian organization that helps poor families become self-reliant. It was started in 1944 by Dan West during the Spanish Civil War. Since its founding, Heifer International has helped 12 million families and 60 million people around the world become self-sufficient. Heifer International operates in the Americas, Africa, Asia and South Pacific, and Central and Eastern Europe.

Ora tells us that in Kosovo, women have been widowed by the war. They have suffered from depression and are poverty-stricken. In the past eight years, they have become self-sufficient through the efforts of Heifer International. In one village, there are five cows producing milk to provide a sustainable income for the widows living there.

One of the most challenging projects in Kosovo has been working on multi-ethnic projects with Serbs, Albanians, and Kosovars. Despite historic enmity between these ethnic peoples, Heifer International has created collaborative projects where they are working together to build a sustainable lifestyle. Ora tells us that everyone suffered from the war and, despite suspicions, are more interested in building peace and maintaining hatred.

Heifer International is supported by donations. People can contact Heifer International through its website www.heifer.org and contribute online. In addition, people can contact regional and local Heifer International offices to provide financial support on local projects.

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The Complexities of Middle East Peace

July 30th, 2010

In the last few shows, I have had various guests talking about their personal experiences in the Middle East, from Iran to Saudi Arabia. On this edition of The Doug Noll Show we turn our attention to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. This is a conflict that endures despite common sense solutions, peace agreements, war, and violence. To help us make sense of what will be needed for peace between these people, I have invited Dr. Alon Ben-Meir to the show.


Dr. Ben-Meir is an expert on Middle East politics and affairs, specializing in peace negotiations and conflict resolution. For the past twenty five years, Dr. Ben-Meir has been directly involved in various negotiations and has operated as a liaison between top Arab and Israeli officials. Dr. Ben-Meir serves as senior fellow at New York University’s Center for Global Affairs where he teaches courses on Middle Eastern studies and international negotiations. He is also a Senior Fellow and the Middle East Project Director at the World Policy Institute. He regularly holds briefings at the US State Department for international visitors, and he conducts back-channel diplomacy to mitigate conflicts.

I start out by asking Dr. Ben-Meir about the status of direct talks between Israel and the Palestinians. Dr. Ben-Meir tells us that, while Netanyahu wants direct talks, the Palestinians are not interested without an understanding of what will be negotiated. Between 1993, 2000, and 2008, just about everything that can be negotiated has been discussed between the Israelis and the Palestinians. Thus, without a firm commitment by the Israelis on what exactly a two state solution would look like, the Palestinians do not see the point in expending political capital. We discuss and conclude that Netanyahu is not a strong leader on peace. His internal political struggles are a result of his refusal to build the peace coalition with Kadima, the major opposition party.

The problem on the Palestinian side of the table is that there is no unified approach to Israel. There are radical groups like Hamas and Islamic Jihad that still deny the right of Israel to exist and have not renounced violence as a means of political change. The Fatah party has not cleaned up its corruption. Since the 2006 elections that placed Hamas in power over Gaza, the Palestinians have been divided. Dr. Ben-Meir tells us that some Palestinian leaders hope that as an agreement on the two state solution comes close, other Arab countries will pressure Hamas to agree. We talk about the interests of the Arab League and other Arab nations. In the past, Arab countries used the Israeli-Palestinian conflict as a cover for their own internal dissensions and problems. Today, however, the Sunni Arabs see the conflict as not in their best interests. In particular, the Sunni Arabs see Iran as an enemy, and in this respect, are allied with Israel against Iran’s nuclear ambitions.

We talk about Prime Minister Salam Fayyad, who is bringing about change in the West Bank. Fayyad sees moderation as the key to success and should be supported by both the Israelis and the United States.

Fayyad has problems of his own. He is not a member of Fatah or Hamas, he holds an American citizenship, and he wants to end corruption. He is facing resistance to change from the entrenched leadership. However, Abbas supports them. Others within the Palestinians believe he is an appeaser.

We talk about the role of the United States in the peace process. The United States is seen as the principal broker for peace in the Middle East because of its close relationship with Israel. The United States must have the full confidence of Israel that Israel’s security needs will be met. The Palestinian Authority needs the political cover that the United States can provide. In addition, it needs United States foreign aid, training and funding of security forces, and infrastructure development money that only the United States can provide.

Dr. Ben Meir and I agreed that the United States mediation efforts have been very poor in the past. U.S. mediators have failed to understand the subtleties and nuances of the conflict and the psychologies of the people involved in the conflict. Furthermore, the U.S. has not taken any steps to change the political rhetoric between the parties.

Dr. Ben-Meir believes that George Mitchell, the current special envoy to the Middle East for President. Obama, is over-rated. While he was successful in Northern Ireland almost 20 years ago, the Northern Ireland troubles were no comparison to the complexities of the Israeli Palestinian conflict. I asked Dr. Ben-Meir whom he might nominate as a mediator. He tells us that the qualities of a mediator should include an understanding of the subtleties of the conflict, being trusted and respected by both sides, having experience in international negotiations, understanding the players, and being able to sort out the issues. Dr. Ben-Meir’s choice of mediator would be former presidents Bill Clinton, who he believes may have the necessary characteristics to be an effective mediator. He believes that President Clinton is a very different man than when he was president. President Clinton has gained perspective and maturity, and is still well-liked by both the Israelis and the Palestinians.

Whatever happens, the opportunity for peace is now open. That opportunity will not remain open for much longer because of internal United States politics and the continued threat posed by Iran. However, Dr. Ben-Meir believes that peace is possible if the United States starts working the parties.

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Surreal in Saudi Arabia-One Woman’s Perspective on Life in Saudi Arabia

July 23rd, 2010

My guest on this edition of The Doug Noll Show has had the unique experience of working as a single professional American woman in Saudi Arabia. Mary Kavanwal is a registered nurse, and looking for something different, ended up with a job in Saudi Arabia. She fictionalized her experiences in two books, “Surreal in Saudi,” and “Awry in Arabia.” I have invited her to talk about aspects of Saudi culture that we do not hear about. Her website is www.marykavanwal.com.


Mary tells us that she is Canadian-born and a hospice and palliative care nurse. When her children were gone, she decided that she would do something different. She tells us that before she knew it, she was on a plane headed to the Middle East.

One of the first shocks she faced in Saudi Arabia was having to wear an abiyah, a full-length cover from neck to ankles and over the wrists. In addition, she had to wear a head covering. She tells us that in the desert heat, it was extremely uncomfortable.

She had been hired to help start a hospice and palliative care program in a large Riyadh hospital. She was there for less than a week when her roommate was arrested and imprisoned.

Her roommate, Rose, was from Fiji and held a New Zealand passport. Rose had been downtown with her boyfriend, which in Saudi Arabia is illegal. Women are only allowed to be with family members or husbands. If with her husband, a woman is required to carry her marriage certificate attesting to her marriage. In this case, Rose was charged with prostitution. Her boyfriend was arrested, and quickly released with a slap on the wrist. Mary tells us about her visit to Rose in prison. She witnessed horrible atrocities within the prison, including rats gnawing on dead bodies, women packed into cells without heating, cooling, or ventilation, and children imprisoned with their mothers. Rape was a common occurrence as was torture. Rose eventually was publicly whipped and ejected from the country.

Mary tells us that Saudi Arabia is a country with closed borders. Visitors are not allowed inside the country without a specific purpose. Unlike many countries, Saudi Arabia requires both an entry visa and an exit visa. The Saudi’s are very suspicious of outsiders, and they are intolerant of different Islamic sects. They believe themselves to be superior to all humanity because they protect Medina and Mecca, the two holy sites of Islam.

Mary tells us that while she was working in the hospital, she was assigned to a VIP unit. She worked with the baby and as a result was told that she would be working with a prominent princess. She was moved to Jeddah, a Saudi city on the Red Sea.

Mary tells us she was overwhelmed the first time she saw the palace. She said it took five minutes just to cross the foyer. Saudi royalty have servants to take care of every one of their needs. Each servant had one small responsibility such that the princess did absolutely nothing for herself, including taking care of her toilet needs. Mary and a colleague were the first Westerners to cross the princess’s threshold. Mary says that she was treated as both a guest and a slave. The family members became very suspicious of her because of her professional training.

In the basement of the palace, young Asian girls were housed as sex slaves. The practice was to go to Thailand and purchase young girls from families. These girls, 9 to 14 years old were passed around and sexually used by Saudi men. When they outlived their usefulness, they were abandoned in the desert to die.

I asked Mary about her perspective on Islam. Mary said “I am afraid of Islam.” She tells us that there are some Islamic sects that are peaceful. She is, however, afraid of the radical beliefs of many people of Islam. She observed a deep hatred within the Saudi psyche, which is much more widespread than is understood in the West. This hatred goes back millennia. Because most Saudi people are still desert-dwelling nomads, there is no significant middle class, professional class, or civic society. For the last three generations, these services have been provided by outsiders for the benefit of the royal family. Slowly, Saudi’s are becoming educated and returning to their country. The shift is slight and there is great resistance to change. Mary thinks that it will take generations for the Saudis to shift from its barbaric ways to a modern post-industrial culture.

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The Danger of Iran: Reza Khalili CIA Spy

July 16th, 2010

If you have been following the international news you will know that last month the UN Security Council imposed new sanctions on the government of Iran for failing to cooperate with the International Atomic Energy Agency. The sanctions are not as tough as the U.S. sought, but do impose a limited arms embargo, travel restrictions on Iran’s Revolutionary Guard, asset freezes, and the right to board and inspect ships thought to be carrying banned materials and supplies to Iran.

Iran has been a thorn in the side of the developed world and particularly the United States since the overthrow of Shah Reza Pahlavi and the Peacock Throne in 1979. Those of us old enough to witness those days also remember the famous hostage crisis, the failed rescue attempt by the US Delta Force, and the release of the hostages when President Carter left office.

My guest on this edition of The Doug Noll Show also lived through those times as an Iranian citizen. Reza Khalili is here to give us his personal perspective on the modern history of Iran. He was a CIA agent working within the Revolutionary Guard, and for many years fed critical inside information to the US government. He has written a memoir of his experiences called “A Time to Betray: The Astonishing Double Life of a CIA Agent Inside the Revolutionary Guards at Iran.” His website is www.atimetobetray.com.


Reza gives us a brief summary of his history, including his childhood in Tehran and his education in the United States. When Reza returned to Iran after the revolution, he was recruited into the Revolutionary Guards. The Revolutionary Guards were initially created to protect the new government against military coups and insurrections. Quickly, the Revolutionary Guards became a powerful force within the government, acting as the intelligence, internal security, and primary military force combined.

Reza tells us that the Iranian government is set up to stifle all dissent and opposition. The people in charge of the government hold a radical philosophy of Armageddon. Their belief is that at the end of time for that second Messiah will arrive. They believe that they are responsible for bringing about the end of time in their lifetimes. Thus, the Iranian leadership is focused on developing nuclear weapons for use on Israel, Europe, and the Middle East. Reza says he has no doubt that once those weapons are developed, they will be used.

Reza tells us how he became disgusted with the corruption and violence of the government of Iran. He was able to travel to the United States on the pretext of visiting a sick relative and offer himself to the FBI and CIA as a spy. He returned to Tehran and conducted espionage for the United States throughout the 80s. Because he was highly placed as a technical expert in the Revolutionary Guards, he was able to pass high-level information on to the CIA.

We talk about Iranian nuclear weapons development program. Reza tells us that there is no practical way to stop the development of nuclear weapons in Iran. Iran is also working on a missile system to deliver the nuclear weapons to Europe and all of the Middle East. Iranian leaders have no interest in the preservation of Iran and realized that a nuclear strike will mean annihilation of their country. They have no difficulty sacrificing the people of Iran to create the chaos that their prophecies foretell. Reza tells us that the Iranian leaders will be happy to strike Israel, the Gulf oil fields, and any targets of opportunity in Europe that their missiles can reach.

I ask Reza about the prospects of revolution in Iran. Reza says that the government cannot be overthrown easily. However, he says, the government is unstable and there are huge rifts within the Revolutionary Guards. Although sanctions will be ineffective, any pressure on Iran is better than none. In addition, the West should be supporting the people of Iran, telling the world that it will support any democratic regime change. Reza believes that the Iranian people have moved beyond dictatorship and are more than ready for a democratic, secular civil society.

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Women in the Law-The Uphill Battle

July 2nd, 2010

Today there are more women attending law schools in the United States than men. Women are finally reaching the pinnacles of the legal profession, with the latest example being Elena Kagan’s nomination to the United States Supreme Court.


Not so long ago, it was not this way. When I entered the practice of law in 1977, there were few women lawyers. With few exceptions, women had not yet risen to prestigious legal positions in private practice, on the bench, or in public service. Fortunately, there were a lot more women graduating from law school in the 1970s, but they had a long, arduous road ahead of them.

My guest on this edition of The Doug Noll Show, Mary Hutchings Reed was one of those women. She received her undergraduate degree and masters degree from Brown University, which as a Dartmouth grad I will not hold against her, and her law degree from Yale in 1976. She went into private practice with two of the largest law firms in Chicago, where she specialized in intellectual property and entertainment law.

Mary became interested in writing and wrote a novel about two women of her generation struggling to succeed in a big-time law firm. Her first novel, Courting Kathleen Hannigan, tells the story of these women from very different perspectives.

Mary tells us that one of her first surprises was as a summer intern at an insurance defense firm in Chicago. Towards the end of the summer, a senior partner took her and the other law clerks to lunch, and, during the lunch, made a statement that no women would ever practice law in a court in Chicago. This was 1974. When Mary was a new lawyer in her firm, when a client meeting broke for lunch, all of the clients and lawyers went upstairs to a private club on the top floor of the building. When the maître d’ saw Mary he blanched, whispered to the senior partner, and the senior partner told Mary that women were excluded from the club. He told her that she would have to meet them in back in the office. Mary tells us that these kinds of practices were routine. Women in the law learned to deal with them because they felt lucky to have a job as a lawyer in private practice. Most young women of the time believed that the legal profession provided a level playing field. Only life experience showed them that advancing in the legal profession was anything but fair and equal.

Mary’s legal career was very successful as she specialized in marketing, advertising, and entertainment law. Among her clients, she represented the flamboyant fight promoter Don King. Sixteen years into her practice, Mary and her physician husband took time off to sail from Norfolk, Virginia to St. Thomas in the Virgin Islands. Upon returning to Chicago, Mary evaluated her life and decided that a full-time legal practice was no longer for her.

Mary tells us how she had always had a desire to write novels, which was why she studied creative writing in college. She resigned her partnership in her law firm and devoted herself to improving her creative writing skills. Her first novel was about two young women in private practice in Chicago.

A listener e-mails a question asking if the way women are portrayed as lawyers in the media, particularly on MSNBC and Fox News help or hurt their reputations. Mary and I discuss the question. We both agree that the television portrayal of lawyers in general, and women lawyers in particular, is nothing close to the actual practice of law. In general, the fact that so many women lawyers are appearing in the media is a good thing for both the profession and for women lawyers.

Mary tells us the story line of Courting Kathleen Hannigan. The story is about two women lawyers in the same firm. Kathleen Hannigan, the protagonist, is a partner. Ann Rose is a senior associate. Kathleen sits on the partnership selection committee, and when the committee rejects Ann for partnership, Kathleen has to break the news. The committee’s rationale for rejection was that Ann was not sufficiently feminine.

And files a lawsuit against the firm alleging discrimination, and the story opens with Kathleen on the witness stand. As a hostile witness, which means that cross examination rules apply, and his lawyer asks Kathleen whether or not her law firm discriminated against Ann. If Kathleen answers yes, her law firm will be found liable and she will be accused by her firm of betraying her partners. If Kathleen answers no, she will be betraying herself and her integrity.

I ask Mary how Kathleen answered the question, and Mary laughs. “Read the book and find out,” she says.

The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf

For this edition of The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf, I have chosen “Bargaining with the Devil: When to Negotiate, Went to Fight” by Robert Mnookin. Professor Mnookin is chair of the Program on Negotiation at Harvard Law School. In his latest book, Professor Mnookin asks the question, “When do you negotiate with evil?” The question arose in his mind after the 9/11 terrorist attacks. Was it possible to negotiate with the Taliban for Osama bin Laden? If such a negotiation was possible, should the United States even engage in it? When should principle come before pragmatism and vice versa?

Mnookin offers up eight stories describing different situations, but all involving a difficult negotiation with a party perceived as evil. In each of the stories, Mnookin provides us with the history and context of the negotiation so that we can understand the moral dilemmas faced by the negotiator. In addition, he provides us with an assessment of each negotiation and provides his analysis of how well the negotiator balanced intuitive insight with rational analysis.

Not surprisingly, we learn that negotiating with the devil is often necessary. In fact, Mnookin advises us that we are almost always better listening to our adversaries, no matter how evil, than ignoring them. The tension, he says, is often between satisfying our sense of justice and facing the pragmatics of the problem immediately before us.

The fundamental process when negotiating with perceived evil is to accept the emotionality of the situation and, at the same time, use a Mr. Spock-like attitude to coldly analyze the situation from both your perspective and your adversary’s perspective. As his stories point out, the best negotiators managed to find a balance between intuition and analysis that leads them to acceptable outcomes. Sometimes, as Churchill did with Hitler, a refusal to negotiate with the devil is the right decision. Sometimes, as Mandela found with deClerk, negotiating with the devil is the only way out.

One of the key points of this book is that intense conflicts cause people to demonize one another. When this demonization occurs, people lose the ability to collaborate in negotiation. Thus, Mnookin advises that if you catch yourself demonizing your adversary, be careful that you do not fall into a negative trap that imperils your ability to make a deal. Likewise, demonization can act as a justification to excuse your own behavior in contribution to the conflict.

This book is a useful addition to any peacemaker’s library, especially for those peacemakers that are not professionally trained in interest-based negotiation. Mnookin makes a great case for why interest-based negotiation is a powerful technique for resolving conflicts with the devil, and this book is obviously written for those people who have not been deeply exposed to the concept.

The book is called  “Bargaining with the Devil: When to Negotiate, Went to Fight” by Robert Mnookin. It is published by Simon and Schuster.

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The Woman That Shot President Ford

June 25th, 2010

Presidential assassination attempts are infrequent, but scary and unsettling events. It’s not often that we get to look into the background, both personal and cultural, of these assassins. Geri Spieler took an interest in the assassination attempt of Sara Jane Moore against President Gerald Ford and wrote a book, “Taking Aim at the President: The Remarkable Story of the Woman Who Shot At Gerald Ford.”


Geri is a journalist and investigative reporter. She has written for such publications as the Los Angeles Times, San Francisco Chronicle, Wall Street Journal and Forbes and a reviewer for the New York Journal of Books.

Geri met Sara Jane as a result of some investigative reporting about the Sybil Brand jail operated by Los Angeles County. Moore contacted Geri, and being curious, Geri arranged to meet Sara Jane in prison. Geri says that Sara Jane was very bright, and talented, but was an emotional mess. Over the course of the years, Geri and Sara Jane remained in contact. Geri’s book originated when Sara Jane told her that she could now write it.

Geri was able to make contact with Sara Jane’s family members and, over a period of time, gained their trust. Immediately after the assassination attempt, the family essentially disowned Sara Jane and refused all media requests. In a nutshell, Geri says, Sara Jane’s family life as a child looked perfect, but was probably an emotional hell. Her father was emotionally aloof and detached, and her mother was never satisfied with anything other than unobtainable perfection. Perhaps as a result, Sara Jane had a strange emotional life. She abandoned her first three children to her parents, who were forced to raise them while in their 50s and 60s. Sara Jane was married multiple times, each time taking on a husband as a new identity. Her last child ended up being raised by a couple that took him in after Sara Jane was sent to prison.

In 1975, many people were dissatisfied with the government. Sara Jane had abandoned her husband of the time and her suburban life in Danville, California to move to San Francisco. She started working at the People in Need project that William Randolph Hearst had established to meet the demands of the Symbionese Liberation Army. The SLA had kidnapped her daughter Patty and made a demand that Hearst feed the poor as one condition of Patty’s release. Sara Jane quickly moved into the San Francisco counter culture and was a member of every group.

The FBI was still running a very large counter-intelligence program, and it recruited Sara Jane as an agent in San Francisco. Sara Jane began to question the FBI’s view of the world and actually became a double agent of sorts. Sara Jane became enthralled with the radical left counter culture of the time and was recruited bu a group called the Tribal Thumbs to assassinate President Gerald Ford.

Geri tells us a little about the assassination attempt. Sara Jane had been picked up and questioned by the FBI and Secret Service the day before. They released her after seizing her .45 handgun. Desperate to get a gun for the assassination, she ended up buying one from a dealer on the cheap. As it turns out, the gun sights were crooked, which save President Ford’s life. Sara Jane was able to get very close to the President and fired shots. Because of the misaligned gun sights, her shots were high. Of course, she was immediately wrestled to the ground, arrested, and jailed.

Sara Jane pleaded guilty to the assassination attempt and was sentenced to 30 years in federal prison. She was released on December 31, 2007 and moved to the east coast. Geri says that she has had no contact with Sara Jane since her release.

The strange story of Sara Jane Moore suggests that sometimes there are not clear explanations for violence. While Sara Jane is highly intelligent and emotionally competent, she is also a seriously wounded human being. Her apparent normalcy is perhaps the same as many people. Yet what caused her to attempt an assassination of a U.S. president remains a mystery.

The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf

For this edition of The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf, I have selected “The Invisible Gorilla and Other Ways Our Intuitions Deceive Us,” written by Christopher Chabris and Daniel Simons. This book originates from one of the most famous psychology experiments in recent decades. In that experiment, Chabris and Simons videotaped eight students passing basketballs in front of a set of elevator doors. Four students were wearing white shirts, and four students were wearing black shirts. When people look at the video, they are asked to count the number of basketball passes between the people wearing the white shirts. They are instructed to ignore the passes made by people in the black shirts. After a robust discussion with the subjects on how many passes they counted, people are asked whether they observed anything else unusual. In every case, more than half of the people who viewed the video failed to see the woman wearing a gorilla suit walking through the basketball players to the middle of the screen, turning and facing the camera, pounding her chest, and walking off camera. Even more surprising, people were shocked that they did not see a gorilla. They believed that they should see everything that is in front of them, and the fact that they missed something so obvious was a stunning contradiction to their own image of how the mind operates. You can see the video for yourself at www.theinvisiblegorilla.com.

The book talks about this particular illusion of mind called selective attention as well as five other illusions that we have about how we think. The six illusions include selective attention, memory, competence, knowledge, cause, and potential. Fundamentally, our minds do not work the way that we intuitively think they work. More significantly, our legal system is based on intuitive understandings of the mind that are hopelessly outdated by hundreds of years. In other words, many of the fundamental principles of law, including eyewitness testimony, the reasonable person standard, and rational choice theory are no longer scientifically supportable. Chabris and Simons discuss instances of witness misidentification that had profound effects on people’s lives, particularly when people were imprisoned without just cause.

This book should be mandatory reading for every peacemaker and mediator. Oftentimes in conflict, we see and hear two completely different stories which causes us to wonder whether the people were even in the same universe together. “The Invisible Gorilla” explains why people can have such radically different stories and still be telling the truth as they understand it. The ideas in this book will cause you to question your own memory and confidence in your thought processes. And, you may develop some compassion for everyone around you as well as for yourself for the mistakes and limitations of our minds.

The book is called “The Invisible Gorilla and Other Ways Our Intuitions Deceive Us” written by Christopher Chabris and Daniel Simons. It is published by Crown Publishing.

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The Invisible Gorilla and Other Illusions We Hold About Our Minds

June 18th, 2010

As a professional mediator, I listen to stories every day. As you might imagine, each side to a conflict has a different story. Sometimes, the stories are so different that I wonder if the people were operating in the same universe. How could two or more people have such fundamental disagreements over what appear to be simple, objective facts?


Then I was introduced to the work of psychologists Chris Chabris and Dan Simon. In one of the most famous experiments in modern psychology, they demonstrated that it is likely that we will not see things that are in front of our very eyes. Basically, we see only what we expect to see. That means that we can potentially miss a lot of information that maybe someone else is seeing. If we compare stories with someone else, it is possible that we will have two completely different stories about the same thing and both be telling the truth as we know it. Chris and Dan published a new book, The Invisible Gorilla, on their work so I invited them both onto the show to talk about the illusions we create in our brains.

Chris and Dan tell us about the six illusions we hold about how we think. We are very good at focusing attention and staying on task, but as a consequence we miss stuff. Actually, we record very little of what we actually see. Chris and Dan call this inattentional blindness. Chris and Dan agree with me that the law is based on intuitions about the operation of the human mind that are 200 to 300 years behind the science. For example, eyewitness testimony is highly valued in courtrooms, but is extremely unreliable. Most people who have been exonerated by DNA testing were convicted on eyewitness testimony. Confident witnesses are credible, but often wrong. Chris and Dan say that our memory does not work like a video recorder. Instead, memory is subject to distortion, modification, and internal creation. In other words, our memories are simply a reflection of a made-up reality to help us in the moment maintain a self-image.

I ask Chris and Dan what we should do with these illusions. First, they say, realize that everybody’s memory is not correct. Second, we should stop arguing about whose memories is correct.

Chris and Dan tell us that we also carry an illusion of confidence that gets us into trouble. We often misread the confidence of others as being a sign of competence. In addition, we are overly-confident of our own abilities, especially when we are least skilled. When someone expresses certainty, we tend to have confidence in them. In addition, less confident people become more confident in groups because they are reinforced.

Chris and Dan tell us about the illusion of knowledge-we misevaluate and think we know things better than we really do. The illusion of the cause is our tendency to pick up patterns in our environment and assume a causal relationship when none exists. Our brains are looking for compelling stories that create meaning in our lives. This leads us to draw inferences and make conclusions that are unwarranted.

I conclude the show by asking how we balance the desires for vengeance, validation, an indication with these perceptual illusions. If we think we have suffered injustice, we want justice restored. However, pending the injustice on someone else may often be a perceptual illusion.

The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf

For this edition of The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf I have chosen “The Verbally Abusive Relationship: How to Recognize It and How to Respond,” written by Patricia Evans. This is the expanded third edition of the book originally published in 1992. It will be of use to peacemakers, because it talks about verbally abusive people. Obviously, many conflicts involve verbal abuse, and this book is a great tutorial on how to recognize and manage the problem.

Patricia tells us that the essence of verbal abuse is the need for the abuser to have power over the victim. This Power Over reality, which she calls Reality I, usually results from an abused or neglected childhood. Thus, childhood abuse begets adult verbal abuse.

The book is divided into parts. The first part describes the nature of abuse and provides assessment tools for recognizing whether or not. You are in an abusive relationship. Patricia does a great job of recognizing the various types of abuse, and the consequences of that abuse on relationships and on individuals. In a verbally abusive relationship, only the illusion of an authentic relationship exists. Verbally abusive relationships lack a quality, partnership, mutuality, goodwill, intimacy, and validation. They are typified by any quality, competition, manipulation, hostility, control, and negation. In part two, Patricia goes deeper in to the characteristics and categories of verbal abuse. Verbal abuse, is, of course, hurtful. It attacks the nature and abilities of the partner. It is manipulative and controlling. It is unpredictable. Most importantly, verbal abuse usually escalates in intensity, frequency, and variety.

Patricia identifies 15 categories of verbal abuse, provides examples for each category, and most interestingly, provides her sense of the tactics a victim can use against each of these forms of verbal abuse. In many cases, the tactics require a firm and strong “Stop that kind of talk right now!” In some cases, it requires disengaging from the abuser by leaving his or her presence. She also suggests calling out the abusive behavior on the spot.

Although abusive relationships are very difficult, Patricia takes some time to talk about how abusers may shift their lives. Often, abusers are completely unconscious about their abusive behaviors. Once they become conscious of the behaviors they are often shocked at themselves. Patricia tells us that intense therapy is usually required to help people overcome their abusive behaviors.

As a reference for dealing with abusive behaviors in mediation, I think this is a good addition to any peacemakers bookshelf. The book is called  “The Verbally Abusive Relationship: How to Recognize It and How to Respond,” written by Patricia Evans. It is published by Adams Media.

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Respect Your Children

June 4th, 2010

We learn peace at home. That may sound like a truism, but the truth is that as children, we learn how to deal with conflicts. Our first and most important peacemaker models are our parents. Whether we learn to live in peace or whether conflict, insults, and disrespect come into our repertoire of behaviors is entirely dependent upon how our parents treat us and each other. So, if we truly want peace, which doesn’t mean the absence of conflict, but does mean dealing with differences, conflicts and disputes respectfully, then we had better be darn sure we are teaching our children to peacemakers. To help us with that idea, I have invited family therapist and author Jay Fitter as my guest.


Jay is a licensed Marriage and Family Therapist from Corona, California. He received his received his undergraduate degree in psychology from Hope International University and his graduate degree in family counseling from Azusa Pacific University. For the past nineteen years, he has counseled with children, adolescents and parents alike, helping them to work through their issues and improve their lives.

His latest book, Respect Your Children, is full of ideas on how to raise a child respectfully, peacefully, and lovingly. Jay’s website is www.respectyourchild.com.

We tend to treat children differently because they are physically smaller and less mature than we are. In addition, many parents feel that “respecting” a child means giving up authority over them. Paradoxically, our children are the only humans we would sacrifice our lives for, yet we tell our children to “shut up.”

I asked Jay why respect for children is not talked in the same way that love is talked about. Jay tells us that most people believe they give their children respect without really thinking about what respect means. In benign cases, disrespect consists of one way conversations and little or no concern for a child’s thoughts and feelings. In abusive cases, disrespect consists of neglect and violence. Kids do not know the difference between respect and disrespect so they will interpret disrespectful behavior as normal and expected. Jay tells his clients that the way they treat their children is the way their grandchildren will be treated.

Fundamentally, being respectful to children is a matter of taking responsibility for one’s self as an adult. To learn to be respectful, parents first have to admit that they are being disrespectful to their children. They must then learn deeper communication skills, particularly how to listen. Finally, they must learn to be consistent. Pay attention to your children because they your need connection. If they do not find it from Mom and Dad, they will find connections they need somewhere else.

I ask Jay to talk about respect for newborns and infants. Infants have very limited communication skills. They need to be touched and loved. Jay relates the story of the famous English study that was trying to understand why some babies in orphanages survived when most were dying. The researchers discovered that the night janitors were picking up and cuddling the thriving infants. While the other babies were physically protected and well fed, they given no love, attention, cuddling, or holding. It turns out that holding a baby is as critical to life as mother’s milk.

For younger children, one-on-one time is a very important aspect of respect. Too often, younger children are taken for granted and not given the time that they need.

Living with teenagers is easier if you have done your work in the earlier years. What you see in a teenager’s behavior is what you taught or what has been taught because you did not respect properly. Jay tells us that if you have not respected your child by the time of six or seven, the child will be checked out. Trying to build a relationship in the preteen or teenage years will be extremely difficult because your child will not trust you.

The conclusion I come to in my conversation with Jay is that peace starts in the home. If we do not respect our children, we cannot expect them to respect themselves, others, or the world they live in, as they grow older.

The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf

For this edition of The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf, I have chosen the book “A Time to Betray: The Astonishing Double Life of a CIA Agent Inside the Revolutionary Guards at Iran,” written by Reza Khalili. Reza is not the author’s true name, and as you read the book you will understand why.

Reza tells his story, starting with his childhood in Tehran. In his college years, the Shah of Iran was overthrown in the 1979 revolution. Reza gives us his personal perspective on the hatred that existed towards the Shah because of his oppressive policies. No one really believed, in Reza’s mind, that the Islamic mullahs would be much, much worse when they came to power.

After graduating from college and getting his masters degree in computer science, Reza secured a job with the Revolutionary Guard. He explains that the mullahs established the Revolutionary Guard because the Iranian military was untrustworthy. In Iran, there are three military groups vying for power: the military establishment, the Revolutionary Guard that reports directly to the Supreme Leader, and the Basiji, the paramilitary group made up of young thugs. From his position in the Revolutionary guard, Reza witnessed abuse and torture, the rape of thousands of young girls, the stifling of dissent, and the execution of his closest childhood friends.

Reza made the decision to talk to the CIA and, as a result, became an agent spying on his own country. Reza gives us an insider’s view of the nature of life in post–Revolutionary Iran. It is bleak, dark, and joyless for many, many people. He recounts the information he passed to the CIA: Iran’s establishment and support of Hezbollah in Syria and Lebanon, its role in the Marine barracks explosion in Beirut, how the Revolutionary Guards were trained in North Korea and China, how North Korea and China supplied weapons to the Revolutionary Guard, and a host of other insights that fleshed out the Iranian Islamist agenda. According to Reza, the mullahs desire to establish a single Islamic dictatorship around the world and will stop at nothing to achieve their goals, including detonation of nuclear weapons on civilian populations.

This book is well-written and reads like a modern day spy thriller. The fact that it is biographical makes the story that much more compelling. If you are interested in understanding one person’s perspective on post-Revolutionary Iran and the politics that drive its internal decision-making, read this book.

The book is called “A Time to Betray: The Astonishing Double Life of a CIA Agent Inside the Revolutionary Guards at Iran,” written by Reza Khalili. It is published by Threshold Editions, a division of Simon and Schuster.

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U.S. Makes Peacemaking Illegal

May 30th, 2010

The United States has made peacemaking illegal. I am not kidding. If you or I were to mediate a violent conflict involving a group designated as a foreign terrorist organization, as the law stands right now, we would be convicted and sentenced to a minimum of 15 years in federal prison.


Ralph Fertig has done something about this. In 2005, fearful that his peacemaking work with Kurds might make him a federal convict, he filed a lawsuit against the U.S. government. His case was heard by the United States Supreme Court in February and a decision is due any day. Ralph is a retired administrative law judge and long time social and peace activist. He has won many awards for his work. Ralph is currently on the faculty of the University of Southern California School of Work.

Ralph is president of the Humanitarian Law Project, a non-profit NGO accredited to the United Nations. The Humanitarian Law Project assesses human rights violations around the world and assists oppressed people in petitioning the United Nations and the international community for relief. Ralph tells us how he was called by representatives of the Kurdish people in Turkey to investigate allegations of oppression and human rights violations. In the 1990s, Secretary of State Condoleeza Rice designated the PKK as a Kurdish terrorist organization. Ralph says that this was a political act to maintain Turkish support for U.S. policies in Iraq. In 2005, the Patriot Act was amended to make any type of expert advice, support, or assistance to groups named by the Secretary of State as foreign terrorist organizations illegal and punishable with up to 15 years in prison.

Ralph tells how he filed a lawsuit against the United States to test the constitutionality of the Patriot Act. Specifically, the U.S. was taking the position that Ralph’s peacemaking activities would be illegal. In oral arguments before the 9th Circuit, the Justice Department lawyer argued that the U.S. government wanted to make foreign terrorist organizations “radioactive,” so that no one could have any contact with them. This included benign and beneficial things like teaching terrorists how to act non-violently, advocate for legal rights under international law, and engage in peace negotiations. The U.S. government argued that the Patriot Act made any peacemaking activity with a terrorist organization illegal.

Ralph’s arguments won in the lower courts, and the U.S. government asked the Supreme Court to look at the issue. The Supreme Court granted review and oral arguments were in February 2010. Ralph and I discuss the oral arguments, and I point out the challenge facing a conservative majority of justices. On the one hand, the majority granted a broad interpretation of the First Amendment when overturning campaign finance restrictions on corporate donations. It finds itself in a dilemma because it obviously wants to support the government position. However, to be legally, morally, and intellectually consistent with its December 2009, it must affirm the decisions of the lower courts interpreting the Patriot Act as unconstitutional when applied to peacemaking activities. As a decision is due before the June recess, we will see whether peacemaking will be made illegal by the Supreme Court.

The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf

For this edition of The Peacemaker’s Bookshelf, I have chosen “Don’t Bring It To Work:Breaking the Family Patterns that Limit Success,” by Sylvia LaFair. The premise of this book is that behavioral patterns learned within the family relationship often carry over to work in unproductive ways. This book helps you get to the bottom of workplace behaviors that simply do not work for you or your organization. Hidden patterns read havoc in the workplace. They rear their ugly heads in the form of power games, “cover your ass” strategies, and other disruptive behaviors. Thus, Sylvia tells us that being “pattern aware” is an important component of mature leadership.

Work teams and families constitute systems of relationships among individuals. Families and workplaces are therefore structurally similar, and they work in fundamentally the same way. Sylvia introduces us to the concept of family systems theory and shows how patterns developed in early childhood to cope with the family system are brought to the work environment. While coping patterns and behaviors might have been useful within a family system, there are often dysfunctional within the workplace. Because of our family experiences, we come into new situations at work with unconscious expectations for how people are supposed to look, sound, and act.

Sylvia identifies 12 classic patterns of behavior and traces them back to family systems. She provides tools for becoming aware of our own patterns and the patterns others display. Her book is full of stories and examples of how family patterns disrupted careers until managers and leaders began to understand the dynamics underneath the behaviors. Sylvia’s solution is to become self-aware. She has a number of exercises to help us do that and then shows us how to break out of our old patterns.

The book is called “Don’t Bring It To Work:Breaking the Family Patterns that Limit Success,” by Sylvia LaFair, and published by Jossie Bass, an imprint of the good people at Wiley Publishing.

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